I'm amazed. :-O

RogerChristie · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 12:24 pm Post subject: I'm amazed. :-O

Hello everyone,

Aloha. Where have I been? The Universal Life Church has a person in it, Brother Daniel, with a very weird and unusual belief. A new member brought this to my attention and for that I am very grateful. He wrote:

***********

"Also, I was wondering if you are aware of the following paragraph from the Universal Life Church web site.

“Ordination as a minister does not entitle anyone to engage in any activities that are unlawful. There exists no freedom of religion to engage in activities that are illegal. Freedom of religion does not mean freedom of practice. Sometimes people have misunderstood the difference. It does not matter if one has a belief in using “pot” as a religious sacrament. Use of that substance is illegal and no religious activity can cover its use. “

From ORDINATION DISCOURSE by Brother Daniel

Which can be found by clicking The ORDINATION link in the Ministerial Training Center at the Universal Life Church web site."

************

I wrote back to our new member:

"I was NOT aware of the ULC comments that you posted to me by Brother Daniel. Very interesting! WoW! :-O

Freedom of religion is ALL about PRACTICING or it's a phoney baloney sell-out to only the illusion of freedom. Is he serious? That Brother needs a tune-up, in my opinion, and it shows that he's un-educated in the ways of authentic sacrament.

That statement by Brother Daniel is a very sad commentary. I pray and wish for him re-newed strength and courage. I pray that he is released from the yoke of his imaginary bondage immediately.

The prohibition of Cannabis sacrament is what's obviously un-Constitutional and therefore null and void. No one is bound to obey an
un-Constitutional law. We have zero civil authority over us, and for that I give great thanks."

###

**Ferre** · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:01 pm Post subject:

Did you know that I am banned from the ulc.net forums Roger?

After Brother Kirby Hensley who founded the ULC had passed on, the ULC has been taken over by ex US militairy Christian zealots, and it shows.

Brother Daniel is all about money making and 'spirituality' is not a priority for the dude.

The sad part is that there are a few people who run about all the ULC websites, one of them is Murph, and Ex US militair, and a dude called Josh, who is still in militairy service, and they are in control.

Even the ULCseminary website is infiltrated by them, that Josh dude is administrator there, enough reason for me to avoid ULC sites as the plague.

ULC has become a money scam, sorry to say so but I found that out already long ago.

Another thing that amazed me is that if you are not PRO WAR and PRO US, like me, you get banned at the ULC
_________________
█ Please read the Board Rules and Posting, and you
█ Radio Free Amsterdam
People who know truth, speak truth.
Those who don't, quote scriptures.

**Ferre** · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:14 pm Post subject:

From Daniel Zimmerman's website:

**Mystic Power** · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 6:04 pm Post subject:

Yes.

Hensley was REAL. His only admonition was, "DO THAT WHICH IS RIGHT."

...and added that only YOU can determine what's right for YOU.

Bliss,
Ben
_________________
"We are the Ones we have been waiting for."
~Hopi Elder ~

"In Lak'ech"
~ Ancient Mayan: "I am another YOU." ~

**Ferre** · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 6:10 pm Post subject:

Yep, and the dudes that STOLE his church now are telling the world that Brother Hensley was "un-religious".

Since the day I found out the true nature of Zimmerman, Murph and Josh I wrote a few emails to the ULC headquarters and all they did was pass my emails (which I had addresses to the ULC HQ) to the owners of the ULC.net website, after that they banned me.

I'm sorry to say, but at ULC headquarters, Hensley's son to be axact, they don't give a damn what happens to the ULC, as long as the money comes in.

I had a little communication with hensley's son and all I can say is that he's a whimp and doesn't guard his father's heritage at all.
_________________
█ Please read the Board Rules and Posting, and you
█ Radio Free Amsterdam
People who know truth, speak truth.
Those who don't, quote scriptures.

zero · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 11:02 pm Post subject:

It doesnt matter either way, because we are not the ULC.

We are the THC ministry. Totally seperate entity altogether.

It is not the ULC that gives us the right to our sacrament, it is the THC ministry. Arguably, it is nature herself that gives us our rights to the cannabis.

I do not believe it is my religious right as a human to smoke weed because the ULC told me so. I believe so because I know in my heart that it is true.

Damn what anyone else says.
_________________
www.shoutwire.com
www.spikedhumor.com

"I understand that fear is my friend, but not always. Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed."

**Torkel** · Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 11:46 pm Post subject:

^^what zero said Wink

Peace,
Torkel
_________________
Miller vs U.S. (230 F 2nd 486,489): "The claim and exercise of a Constitutional right cannot be converted into a crime."

Miranda vs Arizona (384 U.S. 436, 125): "Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no rule-making or legislation which would abrogate them."

HAGANS vs LAVINE (415 US 533 N-3,note 5): "Once JURISDICTION is challenged it must be proven by the Plaintiff."

Rev. Jack · Cannabis Sacrament Minister Joined: 14 Jan 2006 Posts: 242

or·dain tr.v. or·dained, or·dain·ing, or·dains
1. a. To invest with ministerial or priestly authority; confer holy orders on.
b. To authorize as a rabbi.
2. To order by virtue of superior authority; decree or enact.
3. To prearrange unalterably; predestine: by fate ordained.

It has always struck me as odd that THC-M sent people to another church for ordination.
I have what I believe is a some what different opinion about how a minister is Ordained.
We think we decide (and in a way we do by choosing/accepting the moment) but Fate conspires to bring us to the decision to take up the ministry. to accept the seemingly impossible job of trying to change the world.
“A Hero is a common person that when faced with an uncommon situation stands up or lays down to do the right thing. “ “Heroes are not born they are made.” Remember Jonah.
Ordination; To invest with ministerial or priestly authority; confer holy orders on. I see as an acknowledgement of an individual’s sincere dedication by the head/s of the fellowship
So, A person petitions the fellowship, the heads acknowledges them. In our fellowship since most of us are Ordained Ministers perhaps each could make their ordination declaration for each new member if they sincerely feel the petitioner is worthy. If one gives one gives Ordination then the other is ordained. If many give then this show of support it reinforces the Ordination.
I am working on a spiritual autobiography I will post soon that explains why I believe. I would like to see Ministers do this, it is remarkably self enlightening (“know thy self, there’s nothing else to know. you are whole” Kansas?) it gives the body and the heads of the fellowship a testament of why they should be ordained and I like to hear of others experiences, it strengthens and expands my perception of the Universe.

Please except these as suggestions of my humble opinion.

Here is a draft of an Ordination Declaration that would serve our purpose:

I Rev. Jack Roberto, bear witness and acknowledge by virtue of superior authority of the First Source and Center that dwells within myself and all the children of the Universe, that by the prearranged and unalterable predestiny of Fate, Roger Christie by evidence of his labor, the countenance of his words and the sincerity of his devotion to the enlightenment of the world, bears the fruits of his spirit. And should from this day forward be accepted and acknowledged as a fully Ordained Minister of The THC Ministry. Amen.

P.S. Roger I mean every word. Namasta

From:
The Urantia Papers
PAPER 140
THE ORDINATION OF THE TWELVE

1. PRELIMINARY INSTRUCTION

140:1.1 Before the formal ordination service Jesus spoke to the twelve as they were seated about him: “My brethren, this hour of the kingdom has come. I have brought you apart here with me to present you to the Father as ambassadors of the kingdom. Some of you heard me speak of this kingdom in the synagogue when you first were called. Each of you has learned more about the Father’s kingdom since you have been with me working in the cities around about the Sea of Galilee. But just now I have something more to tell you concerning this kingdom.
140:1.2 “The new kingdom which my Father is about to set up in the hearts of his earth children is to be an everlasting dominion. There shall be no end of this rule of my Father in the hearts of those who desire to do his divine will. I declare to you that my Father is not the God of Jew or gentile. Many shall come from the east and from the west to sit down with us in the Father’s kingdom, while many of the children of Abraham will refuse to enter this new brotherhood of the rule of the Father’s spirit in the hearts of the children of men.
140:1.3 “The power of this kingdom shall consist, not in the strength of armies nor in the might of riches, but rather in the glory of the divine spirit that shall come to teach the minds and rule the hearts of the reborn citizens of this heavenly kingdom, the sons of God. This is the brotherhood of love wherein righteousness reigns, and whose battle cry

shall be: Peace on earth and good will to all men. This kingdom, which you are so soon to go forth proclaiming, is the desire of the good men of all ages, the hope of all the earth, and the fulfillment of the wise promises of all the prophets.
140:1.4 “But for you, my children, and for all others who would follow you into this kingdom, there is set a severe test. Faith alone will pass you through its portals, but you must bring forth the fruits of my Father’s spirit if you would continue to ascend in the progressive life of the divine fellowship. Verily, verily, I say to you, not every one who says, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven; but rather he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
140:1.5 “Your message to the world shall be: Seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and in finding these, all other things essential to eternal survival shall be secured therewith. And now would I make it plain to you that this kingdom of my Father will not come with an outward show of power or with unseemly demonstration. You are not to go hence in the proclamation of the kingdom, saying, ‘it is here’ or ‘it is there,’ for this kingdom of which you preach is God within you.
140:1.6 “Whosoever would become great in my Father’s kingdom shall become a minister to all; and whosoever would be first among you, let him become the server of his brethren. But when you are once truly received as citizens in the heavenly kingdom, you are no longer servants but sons, sons of the living God. And so shall this kingdom progress in the world until it shall break down every barrier and bring all men to know my Father and believe in the saving truth which I have come to declare. Even now is the kingdom at hand, and some of you will not die until you have seen the reign of God come in great power.
140:1.7 “And this which your eyes now behold, this small beginning of twelve commonplace men, shall multiply and grow until eventually the whole earth shall be filled with the praise of my Father. And it will not be so much by the words you speak as by the lives you live that men will know you have been with me and have learned of the realities of the kingdom. And while I would lay no grievous burdens upon your minds, I am about to put upon your souls the solemn responsibility of representing me in the world when I shall presently leave you as I now represent my Father in this life which I am living in the flesh.” And when he had finished speaking, he stood up.

Sir Les · Full member Joined: 14 Nov 2005 Posts: 53

RogerChristie · Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:47 am Post subject: Rev. Jack makes a very good point

Hello Rev. Jack and everyone,

Aloha. Thanks for your posts on this thread and I concur. ULC has lost so much of its usefulness that it's time for more formal THC Minister ordinations.

I have enjoyed our association with the ULC in the past for some really good reasons.

1.) They used to be so open to all people of faith.
2.) They have beaten the US federal government for some very fundamental rights that we all can still enjoy.
3.) It's useful for many of our members to have two separate sets of ministry identification in their possession at all times; Cannabis-related, and NON-Cannabis related.

With the latest ULC information presented above, I agree that it's time to shine more with our own ordinations. I'll work on it and see what I can figure. Mahalo for helping me to see this.

All the best to you,

Roger

###

merlingfx · Cannabis Sacrament Minister Joined: 10 Jan 2006 Posts: 52

http://www.startchurch.com/2002/License.asp

I could donate you a copy brother Roger, just let me know.

RogerChristie · Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:30 am Post subject: Yes, please

That www.startchurch.com concept is terrific. Thanks for the tip and your offer. I accept! Mahalo!

Roger Christie
P.O. Box 202
Hilo, Hawai'i 96721

###

merlingfx · Cannabis Sacrament Minister Joined: 10 Jan 2006 Posts: 52

I bought the book for you Roger, turns out its an e-book (unless I wanted to pay an additional amount for a hard copy, but I assumed the PDF format would be good enough)

I have uploaded it to my website and I PMed you the location and password needed to open and read the e-book.

Hope it helps brother... Let me know if for some reason you can't open it...

donHeraldo

There is no shortage of recognized religious sites that offer free or low cost ordination programs and documents to those who feel called and wish to serve.

I received my own ordination from The Church of Gospel Ministry in Chula Vista CA some thirty years ago. I have not kept in touch with them and do not know if they are still active at this time.

The following link is a google search. If the link fails, just do a new search using the following phrase:

ministerial ordination

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLC,GGLC:1969-53,GGLC:en&q=Ministerial+ordination
_________________
Búscate el corazón y encontrarás tu camino.
(Find your heart and you will find your way.)