Growing Sacrament

[jsconcept]

I'm curious, has there ever actually been a case where someone was caught growing cannabis (under or over 50 plants) and got off the charges on the basis of the protection of religious defense offered through the thc ministries? Could someone, hopefully a thc minister, post details of such an event.

[RogerChristie]

Aloha. Thanks for asking. We win incidents almost every single week now with just our id cards, plant-tags and/or Sanctuary signs. So the answer to your question is yes.

Unfortunately we don't yet have a case that's gone all the way through the legal system as a pure win. We still need an injunction, or some other recognition to be totally safe and sound, like enjoyers of peyote have.

Judges and lower courts prefer that our cases just get dropped rather than give us a clean precedent if we're that close to winning. The system is rigged against us big-time. Winning under arrest conditions like we so often do is a significant victory every time, especially for the person involved.

Does that answer it? Let me know. Mahalo.

All the very best to you,

Roger Christie, Founder

THC Ministry


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[jsconcept]

thanks for giving this topic a reply.
It's good that you guys are making such progress in the matter, but i guess it should be understood that there is no guarantees involved with becoming a minister in this religion, it does however offer a somewhat legitimate defense. It's just very hard to concieve that one could get off severe drug charges with this defense (i can't see a judge believing this as a legitamate defense in a serious situation), but from what you saying, it seems that smaller offences like cutivation of a very small number of plants (under 15) or possesion without the intent to traffic (under 28 grams), are more likely to end in a more positive manner. But people should be very aware that this magic herb is still very much illegal, and does come with some rather severe consequences, to go with this religious defense is like a roll of the dice, with slightly better odds.
I'm still hestiant to put down for the kits, interesting as they seem.

[Pepper]

We only believe in sincere religious use and you are actually honoring our beliefs by not joining if it's not right for you. We understand the world still persecutes us.

Most people never even consider they may get caught.

As far as the odds, my kit has been reviewed by the most qualified people
I know. They told me that I have the most solid legal religious defense they had ever seen. I have seen it work as intended.

[jsconcept]

i'm still thinking about getting the kit, i do like the ideas of joining a religion that shares my own beliefs, i just though it should be made clear to anyone considering it, that this is a legitamate religion and not a excuse to break the law. I was just trying to find what the limitations were, theres a fine line between personal religion and criminal activity. As for myself, i fully belive that this sacrement helps promote peace and love while bringing the mind to new level of calm and clarity, a truely a devine connection. My only hesitation was the price, i do want the full package but i'm not sure if i can come up with the proper donation. I hope my inquiry hasn't made me unwelcome to this ministry.

[Brother Adam]

jsconcept - You are absolutely right...this is not some get out of jail free card the ministry is giving away. There's a big line between religious use and those who desecrate our sacrament by selling it like a hooker on every street corner. Cannabis is a gift from the earth itself and should never be involved in something as dirty as commerce. This is where the line of definition becomes very clear. Our ministers don't involve themselves in selling or buying cannabis because that is surely illegal, and it goes against one of the core beliefs of most cannabis users......sharing.
_________________
-Brother Adam (we are all one family)

“Knowledge will forever govern ignorance; and a people who mean to be their own governors must arm themselves with the power which knowledge gives.”

-James Madison

Police officers acquitted for beating a 64 yr old man recently in New Orleans. In the words of their defense attorney "all he had to do was comply"....and they wouldn't have fractured his face.

[Brother Adam]

jsconcept - You are absolutely right...this is not some get out of jail free card the ministry is giving away. There's a big line between religious use and those who desecrate our sacrament by selling it like a hooker on every street corner. Cannabis is a gift from the earth itself and should never be involved in something as dirty as commerce. This is where the line of definition becomes very clear. Our ministers don't involve themselves in selling or buying cannabis because that is surely illegal, and it goes against one of the core beliefs of most cannabis users......sharing.
_________________
-Brother Adam (we are all one family)

“Knowledge will forever govern ignorance; and a people who mean to be their own governors must arm themselves with the power which knowledge gives.”

-James Madison

Police officers acquitted for beating a 64 yr old man recently in New Orleans. In the words of their defense attorney "all he had to do was comply"....and they wouldn't have fractured his face.

[Brother Daniel]

Hello.

I have been encountering attitudes similar to this lately. I am not worried about my court date on June 1 for possession and paraphanelia in Tennessee. I am not worried because it is part of my religion, and is protected by the Constitution, as well as those of all 50 states. People that hear this sometimes scoff, saying something along the lines of "I've never heard of that before."

I then begin explaining about the ministry, and my beliefs. I am still learning and cannot provide the volume of information I would like to, but I try to impart as much knowledge as I can.

I have been speaking with a couple souls about joining the ministry. One thing that I cannot stress enough is that they must honestly believe that cannabis is a divine gift to be shared. If they do not, then the ministry is not for them.

Brother Daniel
_________________
For those who must stop Something...
Stop the Death and Disease of Alcohol and Tobacco

Let's all Just...
Live in Peace with Herb

Watch this video:
Disturbed: Land of Confusion

[King Green]

You are absolutely right...this is not some get out of jail free card the ministry is giving away. There's a big line between religious use and those who desecrate our sacrament by selling it like a hooker on every street corner. Cannabis is a gift from the earth itself and should never be involved in something as dirty as commerce. This is where the line of definition becomes very clear. Our ministers don't involve themselves in selling or buying cannabis because that is surely illegal, and it goes against one of the core beliefs of most cannabis users......sharing.

Oh Yea this is not a "get out of jail free card"

I believe in sharing the blessing.

I'm not sure commerce is dirty, I mean do you daily "dirty your self by working " for another - work - commerce?

I don't believe commerce is dirty but instead a way to pay workers for legitamate labor.

I take it if you believe commerce is dirty then you are rich or a welfare case- I mean afte all if you claim commerce is dirty then you must not work or employ workers.

I have worked and do not consider my self a whore, as my work provide food to feed my family and pay the bills to house them.

I have had to buy cannabis to survive, I needed it like I need food. Thank GOD THOSE DAYS ARE GONE.

Sure its illegal to buy cannabis but ..........

I can see a comparison here to the money changers who sold sacrificial animals, birds lambs and rams.
that were required by their religion to be right with GOD.

Jesus overturned their tables and called them thieves.they took advantage of the people for monetary gain above compensation.

They were there to profit off of the people needing to sacrifice to be right with God because they were only human.



I now expect someone to tell me that sacremental bread and wine are free to all churches- are they? Of course not. WHY? The same reason that you cannot get church id or kit of anykind for free- its the law of energy. People need to be compensated for work, other wise its slavery and you still have to feed slaves to keep them alive for more work.


Food is a gift from the earth , why do farmers want money?

If its wrong to sell cannabis then its wrong to buy it! Since food is sacred too .......



No trip to Amsterdam for me , I can't take my sacred cannabis but would be expected to buy from the money changers _ coffee shops.

Only the beast cares about money, whether you buy or sell!

[B]There's a big line between religious use and those who desecrate our sacrament by selling it like a hooker on every street corner.[/}

So if you equate cannabis to sex then giving cannabis away to everyone on the street corner for free is wrong too?


I don't care I will still give it away for free and yes I expect to be paid if I worked for you or you want to obtain my property.

Go ahead ban me , I'm not a troll but answer and ask hard questions.

If its wrong to sell cannabis then the whole cannabis biz in amsterdam is wrong.

How can one be right and the other wrong?

your loss, but brother or sister I do not condenm you for the way you make a living if you harm no one and provide a valuable service, if I did then I would have to comdem those who .....


Hey if it wrong to sell sex or cannabis then its wrong to buy sex or cannabis and even cannabis seeds.

Explain it better could ya?

[Rev.DeGray2]

[quote=]

Oh Yea this is not a "get out of jail free card"

I believe in sharing the blessing.

I'm not sure commerce is dirty, I mean do you daily "dirty your self by working " for another - work - commerce?

I don't believe commerce is dirty but instead a way to pay workers for legitamate labor.

I guess i am just a forum member then. I would never pay for what i know is more than just what i see or feel. It goes beyond that and i don't work anyways because of my faith that i will not pay the establishment for anything, it is the problem not the solution. Ministers get free will donations that are not required but an offer not for labor or sacrament but for their electric bills or materials like containers or jars for such only if one has money to freely give for any type of these resposnibilities.


I take it if you believe commerce is dirty then you are rich or a welfare case- I mean after all if you claim commerce is dirty then you must not work or employ workers.

I have worked and do not consider my self a whore, as my work provide food to feed my family and pay the bills to house them.

Some do work but that is only what has been created throughout a long period of time-otherwise there would never have been a need.

I have had to buy cannabis to survive, I needed it like I need food. Thank GOD THOSE DAYS ARE GONE.

I need my sacraed sacrament and deity to survive but would never even try to pay for it as i have also came close to death many times from lack of not having any and i only use once or twice every other month or so or even a year so that also makes me just a forum mebmber.

Sure its illegal to buy cannabis but ..........

That is why people all over the world sufferfrom such but here is something else on that......

Of course , most people have no idea how to properly respect the plant spirits. To approah them with an attitude of experimintation is to disrespect their power.

It is also disrespectful to approach them with an attitude of recreation. If you use a sacred plant for religious/spiitual purposes you should never be using them for recreational purposes, because it is an offense to the plant spirit and that includes commerce of any type. That means that if you use a tobacco spirit pipe for sacred religious/spiritual purposes, you can't recreationally smoke ciggarettes and you certainly can't be addicted or habituated. If you are going to use them for sacred purposes you are forming a relationship with them that will last the rest of your life. You will be working in partnership with their spirits not merely exploiting their alkoloids for a good time or anything like it or simmilar and they will hold you to that. Once you have made that decision, You know better. You don't get to be blithely blinded to their true purpose and potential on this earth, which is not to let people have cool trips and talk to light fixtures for fun, social/recreational type purpose.

I can see a comparison here to the money changers who sold sacrificial animals, birds lambs and rams.
that were required by their religion to be right with GOD.

That is really irrelevant, those are acts of elimanting a lifeform not embracing them, some religion where there is such involved.

Jesus overturned their tables and called them thieves.they took advantage of the people for monetary gain above compensation.

They were there to profit off of the people needing to sacrifice to be right with God because they were only human.

I don't know about this jesus and god type of thing or whatever you call them.......


I now expect someone to tell me that sacremental bread and wine are free to all churches- are they? Of course not. WHY? The same reason that you cannot get church id or kit of anykind for free- its the law of energy. People need to be compensated for work, other wise its slavery and you still have to feed slaves to keep them alive for more work.

I don't know about that either so i think i will just soon go-mabey even for good-thinking? for life-long consistent deep meditation and trance.

Food is a gift from the earth , why do farmers want money?

Exactly-remember when there was no money. I beleive in working togethr feed all and live off the land.

If its wrong to sell cannabis then its wrong to buy it! Since food is sacred too .......

Not as saced as cannabis which can feed the world just as us as individuals.

No trip to Amsterdam for me , I can't take my sacred cannabis but would be expected to buy from the money changers _ coffee shops.

If i ever went there i would never purchase cannabis regardles of anything because of the spirits that have ordered me to not do such thing and i wouldn't have to either regardless.

Only the beast cares about money, whether you buy or sell!

Exactly on that.

[B]There's a big line between religious use and those who desecrate our sacrament by selling it like a hooker on every street corner.[/}

So if you equate cannabis to sex then giving cannabis away to everyone on the street corner for free is wrong too?

No they are to seperate things and they shouldn't be doing either but it is the choice of the individuals and those individuals obviously have no respect for themselves or others thus have lost there way if they ever even knew there way to begin with.

I don't care I will still give it away for free and yes I expect to be paid if I worked for you or you want to obtain my property.

Like i said so much for me being anything more here but a forum member, i will never use cannabis do to such, i have no money first second i would never pay for it and third if i ever did have money-more than what i may need to pay electric etc. it would go to another sanctuary for the same purpose, which would not cost anything if it were ran on hemp.

Go ahead ban me , I'm not a troll but answer and ask hard questions.

If its wrong to sell cannabis then the whole cannabis biz in amsterdam is wrong.

I beleive that for sure, cannabis is free not to be sold or bought. It is blessed and free from mother earth-not to be desecrated or disgraced or any of the like.

How can one be right and the other wrong?

We only know which is which by our own individuality- there is no such thing, it is what is positive and productive.

Hey if it wrong to sell sex or cannabis then its wrong to buy sex or cannabis and even cannabis seeds.

Certainly so but is also irrelevant when it already has been equated with sacrificing animals and such. I beleive another negative, I am not going to something like that so forget it on that.

[/quote]
_________________
Much Love and Respect,

Sincerely Rev. DeGray 2

[Brother Adam]

[Brother Adam]